Pawan Rochwani: Hello, everyone. Welcome to another episode of People. Let's show where I'm interviewing CHROs from Southeast Asia region. My name is Pavan Rochwani, and in this episode, I have the opportunity to interview Xandra, who's the current head of strategic HR talent management in ILR corporation. And I have enjoyed this conversation thoroughly because she's somebody who has an extensive 20 year track record.

Pawan Rochwani: She has championed projects across Fortune 500 companies and top players in various industries. She's a transformational talent maestro, and she has been reshaping organizational culture to conquer challenges and reach ambitious goals, and somebody that I have really, really looked upon for understanding how the people and culture and the HR function is evolving in Philippines. I hope you all enjoyed this conversation. And if there's something that you want us to implement in the upcoming ones, please feel free to drop us a comment and Tell us how did you enjoy this conversation. Did you like it?

Pawan Rochwani: Did you what part of it did you like it? And we'll be happy to interview once again. Maybe if you have missed out on asking any questions to Xandra. But feel free to drop us a comment. And this conversation was prerecorded, So some of the context that we are speaking about might be from early this year, but I think it should be fine. 

Pawan Rochwani: Thank you so much, Xandra, for giving us your time and doing this conversation with us. I am really, really thrilled to have you on the show today, and I'm sure you're gonna have some insightful conversations today.

Xandra Galang: Yes. Thanks for having me, Pawan. Great initiative.

Pawan Rochwani: So thank you. I'm very excited with our conversation tonight as well. I'm glad I'm glad we could host you. And Xandra, before we get into Mhmm. All the serious HR related conversations and all of I hope not to see our news.

Pawan Rochwani: Okay.  I wanna first know who is Xandra outside of work because, We wanna start this on a light note and get to know you and what do you do when you're not working anymore?

Xandra Galang: When I'm not working, I'm a dedicated mother of 3, and I'm really balancing a lot of my responsibilities. I know that's It's too boring, but I'm very extreme. You can either see me really partying with friends or really just staying in the couch For the whole day watching Netflix or reading books.

Xandra Galang: So when I took this Myers Briggs personality test, I was in the middle, right, smack in the middle of the introvert and extrovert. So it's it's really just turning it on, you know, whether I want to be with people. Yes. And then yeah. So that's me, outside work.

Xandra Galang: And I'm very active. You can always see me either outside or I get indoors, but I'm always doing something active. Because for me, I feel like I don't wanna waste any of my time. Right? So everything is purposeful for me.

Xandra Galang: Yeah. 

Pawan Rochwani: I  resonate so much with this because, honestly, I have these dates where someday I'm, like, an extreme extrovert Yeah. While I'm meeting people. And then Someday, I'm just like an introvert where I don't need my phone or anything. I just wanna be with the phone couch.

Xandra Galang: Yes. Yeah. You you can have a sense of that. And sometimes, the best people to be with are the same people. You know?

Xandra Galang: You can be together, but Let's not speak for it, you know, for a good movement because I want also some peace. Right? So Yeah. 

Pawan Rochwani: Super. Okay.

Pawan Rochwani: Thanks for answering that. To begin this conversation and, you know, for everybody who's gonna listen to this, What is something that's unique about the people culture at Ayala? What is what is your unique approach that you're building and following at the organization. 

Xandra Galang: You know, it it's Funny because I started my career, you know, I in 1 of the subsidiaries of Ayala. So that's like it's like a full circle.

Xandra Galang: And I was really, really young. I mean, I started with Globe. And then I find myself right? Like, it's really the feeling of being home. Right.

Xandra Galang: When I say being home, it's because you feel like you're in the right place with the right people. So in terms of the culture, I really can say with a lot of the companies that I work with, this is really the best. At least 1 of the best, But people are really collaborative, really nice. You don't need to police them. You know, it it's there's a culture of respect.

Xandra Galang: And, really, people here are young, but at the same time, there's a good balance. I know that we're not supposed to be talking about age, but there's really complementing with the different generations that we have. And it's really feeling this family, you know, that you are with, you know, the right people doing the right thing even when no 1 is Looking at them, that that's the feeling that I have. I've been here now back in Ayala Group for 7 months. And I've been with companies that are really Fortune 500, international, global, but also at the same time local.

Xandra Galang: And I find a young endo middle, which is really the best of both worlds. Right? Because this is still a Filipino company, but at the same time, the mindset, that the leaders are global in terms of their ways of working. So I really like, you know, a good balance. 

Pawan Rochwani: That's that's great to hear.

Pawan Rochwani: And, yeah, I I also feel that, you know, the culture really matters. But at the same time, culture cannot just be by the CHRO or the CEO or the HR. I think the people, the managers, and right till somebody who's, let's say, an intern how they embrace the culture of is also important. So how how management treats its people impacts for everybody to agree.

Xandra Galang: Sure.

Pawan Rochwani: What what are your views about how important is how how management treats people for culture? Well, first and foremost, I believe that the what what you said about the leaders, the managers are really the gatekeepers of culture. Right? No matter what your COE or heads will tell you, it's the day to day experience of people that will build This is what they call culture. Right?

Xandra Galang: So even if at the surface, you do this, but when they're back at their desk or workstation. They don't, you know, feel that or they don't experience that. It's really the moments, the small moments that really matter. So I really believe that it's really the leaders or at least the function of the middle managers, the ones who first really collaborate with the employees. Right.

Xandra Galang: So I I think I I agree with that. And in terms of how the company choose to really treat people, I think the success of organization is intrinsically tied to the call corporate culture. Because if it's It's really the blood of the organization. Right? How you prioritize, you know, the ways of working.

Xandra Galang: That's culture. Right? Do you want a culture of respect? Then and then let what's the return? Right?

Xandra Galang: There's always I really said we're doing something. And for our organization to decide to treat their people right, there's massive, you know, impact On the success of your organization. Because in return, they would want to really give more, do more. That is intrinsic in nature. Yeah.

Pawan Rochwani: Yeah. And and do you think that the smaller things that you do as a culture of the organization that also kind of Builds a sense of community or togetherness with the employees. Like, do you have some small, like, rituals, like, cult rituals? 

Xandra Galang: What I've been you know, I've been here for 7 months, but there are countless of times and opportunities that I had to spend Personal time with my team members. And 1 thing that I really look forward, they always go out of the country, You know, at least once a week for each of the teams.

Xandra Galang: And it's not about, you know, the company would just like to throw in some money. It's not that. I've seen the return that when they are close on a personal level, they carry that, you know, at work. And the collaboration is really actually better when you know someone because you empathize with them at a different level. Right?

Xandra Galang: So I I think So aside from your functional teams, we're also encouraged here in Ayano Corporation because we have subsidiaries to also go outside and Build our community of practice. You know? And in the community of practice, it's not only about you have to deliver. You need to work. Right?

Xandra Galang: There are A lot of opportunities for us to have fun. Again, you know, like, really just get to know each other, what's your personality and and joy, you know, working together and you being very diverse Yeah. In terms of the industries. Right? Yeah.

Xandra Galang: You 

Pawan Rochwani: know, I have had this a small sub question on this, actually. I have had this personal challenge when I was building my own company. Although we were like a small team. But when you become sometimes too friendly people People don't take feedback or criticism well and somewhere that personal and professional boundaries become a little blur. Observe this or do you have certain, let's say, boundaries?

Pawan Rochwani: Yes. 

Xandra Galang: Definitely. And I think that's 1 of the role of Alright. While you want to build that culture, you still want to have, like, a structure. It's like Freedom within a structure.

Xandra Galang: Do not of course, for us, let's not separate being professional as well. Because here in in Ayala, on my first day, I was already given what are my KREs, right, or KPIs. For me, I need to deliver that. Now I need others to deliver that, and they also champion the team KPIs. Right?

Xandra Galang: So, I mean, what I'm saying is that it's not about being overfriendly, oversharing, but it's really adding value also. So there's a good balance with being professional. What's your value? Because at the end of the day, We're still going to be measured about, you know, how much you've done, the value or the impact in the organization, not only with the team, Right. And and individually.

Xandra Galang: Yeah. So, yes, that's the role of HR as well. How do you create that parameters That there's still professionalism. Right? Like, accountability.

Pawan Rochwani: Got it. Got it. Makes sense, actually. And I'm sure everybody who's gonna listen to this, they'll they'll agree to this. Thinking about something that, you know, I have I have had thought sponsoring, which is in an employer, would you, like, rather to somebody who's, like, really talented or somebody who is great as a character or somebody who has integrity or to look for a combination of all 3.

Pawan Rochwani: What really how do you identify a great talent? Like, who according to you is a Great employer, a great team member. I think for me, I'd choose integrity and character, Especially, I'm heading the recruitment. Right? Because talent, you know, that there's it's perishable for me nowadays.

Xandra Galang: You you mentioned earlier, you know, in 1 of our informal discussion, you actually studied a different field Of course. But then you ended up doing something else. Right? Yeah. But you wouldn't say you're not talented what you do right now.

Xandra Galang: May it be 10000 hours that you need for you to be talented at something. But the point is you can hone that. But character and integrity, you know, that's something that you carry wherever you are. So When you hire, your question on how do you know that someone is talented. Actually, it my question circles back With when a person has an integrity to tell me that they don't know everything, but they're willing to learn, they have so much passion and and, You know, drive.

Xandra Galang: That for me, learning something new is a pallet in itself. Right? Yeah. So It's a good combination, but, of course, you always go back to let's just talk about character. I can easily Teach you if you have good character and drive and passion and, you know, engagement and aspiration, all of those things.

Xandra Galang: It's easy with technology right Right now, you know, the process if especially if you have a culture that supports learning, like, for example, you won't need someone's Just your talent. You also need character because you're hiring them for the long haul. Right? 

Pawan Rochwani: Yeah. Yeah.

Xandra Galang: And you mentioned that you also started you you started your own organization. Right? 

Pawan Rochwani: Yes. Yes.

Xandra Galang: Did you also use the same principle? Did you hire for talent? Because in tech, it's so hard just to hire for a character. You need that hard skills. Right?

Pawan Rochwani: Exactly. How 

Xandra Galang: did you handle that? 

Pawan Rochwani: And, you know, that's that's where the dilemma actually came from where You you know that, okay, this person is going to have a remote role only. So it's not like his physical presence in the office kind of, you know, creates a problem for our culture or things like that. And at the same time, you also know it's not easy to find somebody else with the same skill set at the same cost.

Pawan Rochwani: And when you when when it was early in the stage, It was okay to prioritize the hard skills or character, integrity, and the soft skills. But I'm sure you grow from, let's say, Hundred to 500 employees to thousand employees. At that point of time, even 1 1 person can, like, Spoil the entire culture. So I think later stage of organization, it becomes important to not ignore. I agree.

Pawan Rochwani: But in the beginning, as a start up, you are just, like if if you have so many problems, you have to prioritize which problems to, like 

Xandra Galang: Oh, yeah. I agree. Yeah. 

Pawan Rochwani: Really, like, go after. So and most of the times, the problem that was prioritize that.

Pawan Rochwani: Okay. We need to do it in a specific budget. So you have to let go of certain of your own principles. I think later on when we grew that was not the case. We did prioritize integrity and character to run, you know, a culture fit.

Pawan Rochwani: A  culture fit. Yeah. 

Pawan Rochwani: And and not just the hard skills of, okay, which product Can you use? What can you build? Which language can you code in and all of those things?

Pawan Rochwani: So, definitely, like, later stage, yes, align with your philosophy. Tell me about if if somebody has the character or, let's say, the passion to upscale and the passion to, like, learn. Mhmm. How do you enable that? I mean, I Are you looking at standard ways of an LND program or an upscaling program that okay.

Pawan Rochwani: We'll give you LinkedIn learning subscription and Go ahead. Complete this course. Mhmm. Because not always that works. Sometimes, like, you need a little bit of a collaborative learning experience.

Xandra Galang: Yeah. 

Pawan Rochwani: But what are your 

Xandra Galang: I used to handle learning and development. So it's actually 1 of my first love in HR. Right? I think the very first thing that you need to do is to teach people how to learn.

Xandra Galang: Because there are different ways. Right? I look at it like the love language also that you learn best when you're working with someone, when you're doing it. You know? You I'm sure HR practitioners who are listening right now, they can relate to the 70 20 10 return.

Xandra Galang: That 70 percent will be retained if you do it, like, I think that's still, you know, the same philosophy. But what I think, if I can add to that, is that In the mentorship, in the coaching and mentorship has to be inspiring in terms of learning. People should be inspired to learn. Right? Because that's where you can get the intrinsic drive to really learn something.

Xandra Galang: And and It's not only because, okay, it will give me higher salary, but it's because I really want to be good at what I do so that can enable my organization, and I can help more. Yep. Yep. Yeah. 

Pawan Rochwani: And apart from upscaling and, you know, that investment that okay.

Pawan Rochwani: The organization wants you to upscale. I think other thing that works really well are Rewards and recognition. Like, not always employee of the year kind of an award, but sometimes a smaller, like, just from your manager. Yeah. Recognition 

Xandra Galang: and pat on the back.

Xandra Galang: Yeah. 

Pawan Rochwani: Exactly. I think that that kind of, like, works really well. 

Xandra Galang: Mhmm. 

Pawan Rochwani: At the same time, I do understand in this past year, at least in India and the and in the US, The budget cuts and that economic downturn kind of has started.

Pawan Rochwani: So the youth words and programs that we would have probably don't exit exist at that scale anymore. Has that been a similar case with you? Or, like 

Xandra Galang: Mhmm. 

Pawan Rochwani: What's your current, like, rewards and recognition at Ayala? 

Xandra Galang: Our it's it's very flexible.

Xandra Galang: In fact, we called it, you know, FlexBend. So, definitely, there's a good balance between, You know, monetary. And then there's also a component of being flexible because some of the employees are majority, let's say, single. So it it doesn't matter whether you have a good, you know, health card for the whole family that covers x x million because they won't be able to use that. So now the thing is that we balance that that they can withdraw actually a good portion of the health care so that they can use it for traveling.

Xandra Galang: And then We make it very simple, like, really big amount, and then you can use it for travel. When you say travel, reimburse your hotel, your airfare. You know? A lot of Very what do you call this? Customized or very creative ways that you'd say, I've never seen something like this Before, you're free to if you want gym membership, if you have you know, whatever it is, but you have a good cut of the portion in terms of the rewards.

Xandra Galang: Another thing that I really like with the approach of Ayala is that we do the livelihood studies. We really look at how much will this person need if he is, you know, a a father of 3, for instance, with 7 in the household. And and that's really if you live here in the Philippines, you know, how how much do you need? And really could create you know, we we have Great studies that we when we show that we are at par, you know, at 10 percent percentile just really proves that We're not shortchanging our employees really with what they deserve and that they can live comfortably here in the Philippines. Yeah.

Xandra Galang: Yeah. 

Pawan Rochwani: Got it. I think that's great. I mean, not keeping it as standard, is that okay irrespective of single or different. 

Xandra Galang: Yeah.

Pawan Rochwani: I think that's that's really great as a program, and I'm I'm glad that you folks are doing this. My next few set of questions are specific to the new technological advancement that are happening in the HR function, not just within recruitment or l and d or rewards and recognition and, of course, with an employee experience, employee engagement. But in general, like, have have you already started seeing, like, a boom of newer products, It's new technologies. Of course, AI is obviously, like, the the buzzer. 

Xandra Galang: Mhmm.

Pawan Rochwani: But have you already started implementing some of these? Definitely, yes. In fact, we just, you know, opened a new department that is really for AI And data analytics, and we are the best in the Philippines. Right? We're seeing a lot of that, you know, cloud computing, AI, Gen AI, cybersecurity data science.

Xandra Galang: So, sir, it's really in our purview to really look at the top skills that we need to prepare. So when we did our talent planning, so at the start of the year, we always match the current organizational goals with our departmental priorities, and then we map out the talent capabilities that we will need for us to deliver that annual KPI or KRA. Right? Mhmm. And not only that we list on the capabilities, The the functional or technical capabilities that we need right now, we also include what are the fastest, You know, tech skills that we need to start learning right now, and we introduced programs already so that we're 1 step ahead.

Xandra Galang: So even if it's something that we anticipate, we will need in 5 years from now, We're starting to really learn that and really invest with the teaching our employees with with the technical skills. 

Pawan Rochwani: Correct. And which which, let's say, um, aspect within HR, are you also upscaling the people leaders to make them ready for the next set of technologies or products that are going to come in future. 

Xandra Galang: Yes. So, again, not only in the l and d, actually, us in HR, we're also doing digital transformation.

Xandra Galang: With the HRIS, we're also revamping the whole, you know, end to end with the new processes in the life cycle of our employees. We're We're introducing already how technology will enable us. Let's say, you know, we always have survey. How do we do nudges now? We have.

Xandra Galang: You know, you've you've heard about ChatGPT. It has you know, there were some arguments whether it's safe, but We've we've really planned out how to upscale people so that we know what it is, what are their risk, and then we've Trained everyone on it. We've given ample time for people to also pilot so that they're also comfortable with the new technologies. Right? So we're slowly introducing that not only for HR, but also for the people leaders.

Xandra Galang: And these are programs that are open for everyone because it's aligned with the even at the Mancom level that, hey. These are The tax chaos that we need to know right now. 

Pawan Rochwani: Got it. And I've also, like, seen this on your LinkedIn that as, like, a passion project. You have made it your mission to give it back to the HR community through the step training and development.

Pawan Rochwani: How how do you manage this outside of work? Tell tell us Well, 

Xandra Galang: you know the 7 habits. Right. You put your big rocks first. I think it has always been 1 of the big rocks for me to really give Back.

Xandra Galang: And for me, it's it's a passion project that I really spend time every Saturday. I I teach right now in in, You know grad school, I I'll give in a year, I'll take probably 2 courses. That's about 4 Saturdays that I will really spend, You know, out from my family and because that's really something personal to me. That's how I you know, they say that Every role or every occupation that you have has a potential to really Either be holy or have create or create an impact to the lives of other people. And I think What what it what's in it for me, right, for a corporate?

Xandra Galang: That's how I make an impact externally and how I help other people also with their lives. Yeah. As mushy as it is. But yes. Yes.

Xandra Galang: You really don't get anything from it, but really just the satisfaction that You're helping people, you know, young people, inspiring them, and then yeah. So it's it's really part of my mission to spend time, allocate time for that. 

Pawan Rochwani: Got it. And and I know just just a few minutes back, we talked about what makes someone a great talent based on character integrity. But what do you think according to you Makes a great HR leader, a great people leader.

Pawan Rochwani: What's, like, the anatomy or the Of a great 

Xandra Galang: leader. HR leader. Yes. For me, it's really a business partner. A lot of HR leaders are very textbook.

Xandra Galang: You know, graduates from This school really learned about, you know, from a lot of the principles, the frameworks, the concepts from books. But it's really about being a business partner to the organization that you're serving. Right? And it's really understanding the objective even how are you partnering with the leaders to really leverage on what you know in HR so that they are They're able to thrive also, there was. So I think it's it's really establishing that strong business acumen And a strong collaboration with the leaders, that's very crucial as a as a great HR leader.

Xandra Galang: So I don't want to be called as a fluffy HR. I want them to think that I'm also good with my numbers. I know my EBITDA, those things, because I'm a real enabler of performance at work. Yeah. 

Pawan Rochwani: Got it.

Pawan Rochwani: Okay. I'm gonna move to my last 2 questions. And 1 of them is, like, really light, and 1 of them is a little I would That's okay. I I'll put the big rock first. And I'm I'm sure every HR leader has to, you know, Communicate changes in the organization 

Xandra Galang: Mhmm.

Xandra Galang: Implementing 

Pawan Rochwani: that change, and quite often changes met with resistance. It could be, let's say, coming back to office. Like, the pandemic gave us a work from home culture and, you know, later on, if it was hybrid or work from office. It definitely has gotten certain distance. But multiple times, A lot of changes happen in our organization, and the heat has to be faced most of the time by the HR team.

Pawan Rochwani: How do you survive that? How do you implement these changes so that there is less resistance? Do you have a strategy around this? 

Xandra Galang: So it's good that my background in college is communication. Sadly, a lot of the technology that That I learned before is obsolete right now.

Xandra Galang: There's no more TV. There is no more radio. Hence, we have podcast. Right? But the essence of, You know, communication, authenticity, that empathy with people is a tool for me in every change.

Xandra Galang: Definitely, I always communicate that. Some big restructuring. You're not going to be reporting to this, or you will be part of this organization. It's never easy. Right.

Xandra Galang: But I think my strategy is I really emphasize on transparency. And, really, the first is the hardest Because they need to believe that it's bringing them good than bad, you know, with the change that you're introducing. So there's also some creativeness that you need. Right? How do you create that that sense of Goodness in the change.

Xandra Galang: And sometimes it's not always good. Right? But how do you Twist that. That it's more of a benefit for them. Yeah.

Xandra Galang: I think that's 1 of the strategy that's really hard if you're managing. Another Style that I'm doing is really studying the highest impacted group or at least change impact. Right. I'm also a change manager in a way that I prepare. So I don't go out there and just Being optimistic and trusting all my skills in communication, but I really prepare at an individual level who here has the most resistance, Thanks.

Xandra Galang: Group them together. What's my approach then? It's never a 1 size fits all. And at the same time, who are the people who can be your supporters? How can I use them So that they helped me?

Xandra Galang: So it all of a sudden, it's not my battle anymore. It's us now helping each other. Right? So I guess that's There's a lot of gamuts on change management, but those 2 are actually most of mostly effective in the way that I handle resistance. 

Pawan Rochwani: Got it.

Pawan Rochwani: And, of course, like, you whenever that change is happening within the org, you have to also create, like, a safe space or that environment of trust so that we'll that this changes for a bigger goal rather than, you know, something like that's very transactional and temporary. So I think that communication would definitely be of great help. And sadly, coming to my last question, I've I'm having a great time talking to you, Xandra. But my last question is about what is something that you do as an HR leader, That's unique to you, and most of the HR leaders don't agree with you or don't believe in this kind of, Let's say a strategy or the uniqueness that you're doing. 

Xandra Galang: I think it's because I'm very jolly.

Xandra Galang: And I think 1 of when I was younger, I always hear that I'm too vulnerable, you know, when I lead people. And I questioned, you know, that strength of mine. But now I'm very confident with the things that I have achieved. I wouldn't achieve this if I did not lead with authenticity and vulnerability. So I think that's 1 thing.

Xandra Galang: That's that's a powerful approach Because I can foster trust, collaboration. And, again, don't get me wrong. It's not being unprofessional. It's still yours you can be vulnerable, But still be seen as credible with the character integrity and the way that you really do your work. Right?

Xandra Galang: I I think that's something that I'm doing Differently. Maybe most of the HR leaders. But when you see HR, they always look at them. Oh, you should be prim and proper, you know, and and Should be not too loud or, I don't know, whatever bias that they have about HR. Oh, I I will report you to HR.

Xandra Galang: Don't do that. So You're always like the police. You're always, like, you know, the bearer of bad news. But for me, I want to make it light. You know, I hope everyone makes it, And and you're here really to to make their lives better.

Xandra Galang: Right? So that's my ultimate purpose in in leading as an HR leader. 

Pawan Rochwani: To work. I'm I'm sure everybody who works in your team and, like, sees you 

Xandra Galang: Yes. Would 

Pawan Rochwani: really share that.

Pawan Rochwani: I know that's something that they appreciate about you as a leader. So I'm glad that we could hear this. And thank you so much, Xandra, for taking out the time. I'm sure everybody who's going 

Xandra Galang: so much also for inviting me. And I'm really I really had a great time talking to you even, You know, before this podcast.

Xandra Galang: So let's continue. Let's stay connected. I really can sense you're also a Johnny person like Me. So I'm sure when you're here in the Philippines, let's you know, let's spend time and and really go out also and see how we party here. 

Pawan Rochwani: I hope we both are extroverts on that particular day.

Xandra Galang: Yes. Have you tried Tara Okay already here in the Philippines? 

Pawan Rochwani: Yeah. I'm I'm actually gonna be in Feb second or third week. We are hosting, like, a small, let's say, closed door kind of event.

Pawan Rochwani: It's not, like, yet fixed. I'll I'll let you know once, like Wow. 

Thank you. Thank you. Yeah.

Pawan Rochwani: So Enjoy. 

Xandra Galang: Thank you for for inviting me. This is To create, you know, initiatives. Yeah. Yeah.

Xandra Galang: Congrats in advance.  

Pawan Rochwani: Okay. I'm gonna pause. Thank you.